I apologise for the excessive "male-orientated" viewpoint in this post. I tried to keep it neutral but somehow, it just works better when explained from a male viewpoint.
Here's a phrase that I've seen repeated throughout the comments on this blog on several occasions;
"I know that he won't miss me when I'm gone because he's aspie"
Today, we're going to (try to) bust that myth;
I'll start off with a reminder that everyone is an individual. If all aspies were completely alike and predictible, they'd be a stereotype but they're not. Each is shaped by their background, their upbringing, their beliefs and their local customs.
An aspie who grew up with loud abusive parents has a reasonable chance of becoming loud and abusive themselves because in some cases, that's all they know. That's how they think adults are supposed to behave. In other cases, aspies who grew up in those circumstances do a complete about-face and say "I'm not going to be like my parents"
A lot of aspie behaviour comes down to personality and individual choice.
Some aspies choose to be good mothers, fathers, husbands, wives, boyfriends or girlfriends while others choose to be angry, abusive, controlling or simply aloof and untouchable.
It's not the aspie condition that drives the choice.
Different Types of Expression
It's commonly stated that dogs have owners while cats have staff.
It's believed that dogs are caring creatures because they whine when you leave them and jump around excitedly when you get home. Dogs seem to want to be with you while cats often seem to have specific objectives, like food or a brush, in mind.
Sure, there are some dogs and cats which break the mould. Some dogs obviously prefer their own company while some cats are amazingly sociable. These are exceptions - and the rest are the "stereotypes".
I'm ready for the deluge of complaints from cat owners.
It's not really like that though is it? Cat owners will tell you that their feline friends are just as happy to see them as dogs are. It's just that cats express in a different way.
Do you see where I'm going with this?
NTs are Actors, Aspies are thinkers
Aspies express in different ways too.
Your typical lovestruck neurotypical boyfriend will behave like a dog. He'll call you constantly, he'll buy you flowers, gifts and chocolate. He will come around to your house late at night and yowl like a cat and he'll constantly shower you with words and gestures of affection.
Wow, awesome... you must really be loved...
Except, that these guys are putting on a well rehearsed show. When they get sick of you, they simply move on to the next target and put on the same type of show. It's not unique or individual. It's just the way they show their love. Some are sincere and some are not - but the "show" is always the same.
In contrast, the aspie boyfriend is very much a thinker. To him, everything has its place and he'll try not to monopolise your time. He may be so cautious about hurting your feelings that it feels like the relationship is going nowhere because he doesn't say the words you expect to hear. Sometimes, particularly when you're hammering him with questions, he answers truthfully and discovers that you hate him for it.
Just as there is no correct answer to "do I look fat in this dress?", there is no correct answer to, "do you want to stay just friends or are we more than that?"
Aspie men will often ponder the depth of their love and friendship for hours yet when they come to talk about it, it comes out all garbled and offensive.
I know some aspies who frequently say the most inappropriate and offensive things about - and to - their girlfriends. They don't realise that the truth really can hurt. In one case, I have a friend who is no longer with his girlfriend and yet while I'm sure she's mostly forgotten about him not a day goes by when I can't tell that he's still "burning up". She's been on his mind constantly for years even though she's out of the picture.
If that isn't love, then I don't know what is.
Honour vs Wants
I've told this story before though I'm not sure in how much detail. It's a story which I think gives an understanding of how an aspie can miss and can love someone while still giving the wrong impression. It's my story;
Before I was married, When I was going out with my wife, I started to panic about my priorities. I found that I simply couldn't juggle my work and university committments with a social life.
I tried to go out once per week and I had an all male group of friends who competed for that once per week spot.
My girlfriend was keen for a more frequent relationship. She hassled me for more time and would often ask me where we would be in a certain number of years. I tried to answer honestly, taking into consideration that she would say "in two years" when I was only part-way through a six year degree.
My answers did not impress her and she continued asking them hoping for better answers.
In the end, we broke up.
I couldn't afford the time and I really couldn't concentrate on so many things at once. I could tell that she wanted more and I knew that I wasn't in a position to give it.
I didn't want her to go but I thought I was doing a noble thing by letting her go. I didn't chase her because I thought it wouldn't allow her to leave in a dignified manner. I made a huge personal sacrifice by letting the most important part of my life leave.
I thought I was doing the right thing.
She didn't think so. She didn't appreciate it for the sacrifice that it was. I didn't communicate my pain because I thought that would make it more difficult for her.
Isn't that what the hero always does in movies?
For the next year, I burned inside. I thought of her often but didn't call. I wasn't going to pass my pain on.
When she finally did get in touch with me and told me that she'd found someone else - it hurt. I sat there listening to her telling me how great this person was and how he saw her almost every night - compared to my paltry once-per-week.
I acted happy for her but really I felt sick inside.
Still, I went on being a "hero" for her. I suffered in silence for her.
It was only when she came to me and told me about being mistreated by her boyfriend that I changed. I'd learned that the relationship was a bad one and I no longer had any qualms about breaking it up.
I asked her to go out with me instead.
...and she hesitated...
It really, really tore me up. All that time when I was suffering, I thought that I was doing the best thing for her but as it turned out, I wasn't considered much more highly than the abusive boyfriend.
In fact, I ended up having to compete with that abusive boyfriend for her attention (and fortuantely I won).
In the process, I learned from what she'd told me of his behaviour. I learned how to be the sort of person she wanted.
It was horrid experience but I think it was something I needed to learn.
The way forward for me was to change my life to fit her in and surprisingly - my university grades actually improved. I think that my lonely year of self-pity and suffering had actually done my work more harm than good.
The funny thing is; even today, she's still completely unaware of just how much I missed her.
Second, when you described the typical Aspie boyfriend who says "the most inappropriate and offensive things about - and to" their current or former partner, I definitely recognized myself. As a female Aspie, I always have and always will behave just like that. I do realize, of course, that the way society works right now, it is much easier to do those things as an attractive woman than as a man. So I think your post makes several important points.
Good job! Your blog surely does make a difference.
I sometimes feel as if there is a mental block that stops me doing things that seem false, even when I know that people expect them (and even when it is not false that I can love and miss someone). I think that by false I mean 'not matching up with my emotions at the exact moment that people expect me to say or do something'.
I can relate well to your example of dating your future wife. When my future wife (Della) and I were dating, she was often a bit peeved at my devotion to my grandparents. If we had a date planned and my grandmother called to say she needed some assistance, I would postpone the date, much to Della's dismay.
Like you, we broke up for a while. I kept to myself which Della took to mean I was no longer interested. Of course, she couldn't have been more wrong. Like you & your wife, we were fortunate to move happily beyond that episode.
Still, we enjoy a very atypical marriage (e.g., we sleep in different rooms on different floors) and most of these oddities are a direct result of my unique aspie personality.
Can any of the Aspie male participants shed light on one thing? How, then, do you express your love or desire or like for an NT, who is likely to be influenced by her own cultural definitions, and/or media-concocted ones, of how to express affection?
The abundance of 'He's Not That Into You' style books on how to look for the clues and signs are a perfect example how rigid our views of love can be.
I really enjoy this blog. I've never felt compelled to participate in one before. Thank you Gavin!
Those poor girlfriends. Why do they stay with people who do things that hurt them?
Did someone accuse them of anti-aspie discrimination for not wanting to keep dating people who frequently say the most inappropriate and offensive things about - and to - them?
Are some of these girlfriends from cultures with "stop crying about loneliness!!! shut up and study!!!" customs? Did someone accuse them of selling out to the West and being frivolous for caring about social skills instead of lying back and thinking about the men being good providers?
Are some of these girlfriends Aspie themselves? Did someone accuse them of betraying their people and selling out to NTs for caring about their self-respect instead of lying back and thinking about neurodiversity?
Good communication can help, which is where adding an aspie or two into the mix can make things very tricky.
I am in an aspie/aspie relationship. He is somewhat non-verbal. He is Aussie and I am American. We are pregnant, six weeks along.
He has been saying and doing things that I was interpreting as him not wanting the baby. Naturally I was upset so I went in another room and quit talking to him. Hours later he came to where I was and tried to pay my shoulder and I said, "Don't ever touch me again."
He took off, out of the house and into the streets of the Sydney suburbs. Eventually I ended up in the bedroom to find little notes he was writing to himself about all the questions he had. He was afraid and he worried that when the baby comes he won't be good enough.
But the main thing, the thing that led him to say and do the things that I interpreted as him not wanting the baby, was his inability to deal with the idea that this baby could hurt me, damage me, or kill me, which is exacerbated by the fact that I am 44, this is my first and I have a medical condition that could put both my life and the life of the baby in danger.
I had been feeling willing to just walk away from him when his real concern had been about me all along.
I guess my point, in this long comment, is that we shouldn't ever assume what someone else is feeling, especially when it is someone who is unable to express themselves well.
Thanks. I extend my continued appreciation for your blog.
I'd like to think he is 'burning inside' for me and is simply unable to communicate that, but what I actually think is that he simply doesn't care. He's done.
Unless he gives me a chance to ask him, meet him and chat with him, I will never know. And he's not giving me that chance.
i want to make this marriage work, but it can be very difficult to communicate with him, especially when we disagree or i am trying to explain how i feel about something. what are some communication tips?
This has been very emotional for me because i have felt like i was crazy and that he didn't love me
"Did someone accuse them of selling out to the West and being frivolous for caring about social skills instead of lying back and thinking about the men being good providers?"
It is my understanding that - statistically - an overwhelming majority of Aspies are, in fact, westerners. And white.
If you can, get hold of a movie called Mary and Max. It's outstanding. Google it.
There is a pure innocence about Aspies that makes being with them intoxicating: in my experience, they do not judge. They do not deliberately set out to hurt anyone. Their motives and intentions are pure - albeit unrefined, unpolished. They are not jaded, consumerist or materialistic. They are not fixated on keeping up with the neighbors. They care not about celebrity culture, pop psychiatry and the latest trend. Life is pared down for them.
A capitalist, consumerist woman who has grown up watching Oprah pontificate about what is an 'acceptable expression of love', who has watched the Tom Cruise baffoonery of jumping on a sofa to express his public love for Katie, who watches all the diamond ring 'let her know how much you love her' commerials on TV and who has watched too many rom coms and Hallmark movies will not easily accept an Aspie in her life because her head will be filled with propaganda. And some incredibly beautiful people will escape her notice because she is waiting for the guy with the biggest expressions of attention and affection.
There is abuse, and there is honesty. Some people cannot differentiate. And lots of women buy into the consumerist myth.
I met up with my ex today. His demeanor was serene, even content, I'd say. I should explain that I've known him 2 years. We dated a short while and he ended it saying he didn't want to be in a relationship. We lost touch and became intense friends again about 8 months later. Then, after about 4 months, we started dating again. At the time he said he had never stopped thinking of me and that he's had plenty of time to reflect. That he will never find anyone more perfect for him. But two weeks ago he ended it saying again - after I ASKED HIM if he was happy carrying on in a relationship with me – he did not feel as passionately for me as I do him.
I asked him today if he thought he was in the Asperger spectrum. He said 'Yes'. I asked if he measured his feelings for me against what he has felt in the past for someone else or against what he believes I feel, and he said against what he has felt for someone else. I asked if it was his ex K, and he said 'probably'. He'd have said 'NO' if it wasn't her, right? Previously, he had told me that she was not the right person for him - she wanted kids, lived abroad and was a Christian.
I asked if he was happy with the decision he made in ending it. He said 'Yes'. He said he is happier on his own, yet he's been maried before, has a child and has had one other relationship I know of. He also said he felt I had pressured him into having a relationship with him because it was what I wanted. He said he felt he had to try a second time. He said I should go away and date someone else so I can see he is not such a nice person after all.
I'd like to think he's really burning inside and merely hindered by his Aspie tendencies, and bitterly disappointed it didn't work out and that it has decimated our friendship and me. I'd like to think I meant something to him. We were mates after all and spent an inordinate amount of time together.
Instead, I'll go away and lick my wounds, knowing that, Aspie or not, I simply meant nothing to him.
Thanks for your blog posts
"'Did someone accuse them of selling out to the West and being frivolous for caring about social skills instead of lying back and thinking about the men being good providers?'..."
I'm Asian-American and I've had to put up with some of that pressure from some of my relatives to behave in ways some other people describe as Aspie.
"...A capitalist, consumerist woman who has grown up watching Oprah pontificate about what is an 'acceptable expression of love', who has watched the Tom Cruise baffoonery of jumping on a sofa to express his public love for Katie, who watches all the diamond ring 'let her know how much you love her' commerials on TV and who has watched too many rom coms and Hallmark movies will not easily accept an Aspie in her life because her head will be filled with propaganda..."
News flash: some people have preferred extroverted behavior since thousands of years before Oprah was born and Hallmark was founded.
"...And some incredibly beautiful people..."
Incredibly beautiful *to whom*? If she's passing them up, chances are they're not incredibly beautiful to her in the first place.
"...will escape her notice because she is waiting for the guy with the biggest expressions of attention and affection..."
What's wrong with different people having different sexual preferences and some women (and some men too!) actually preferring bigger expressions of attention and affection?
Nobody *owes* someone else sex and romance. No means no, and you always deserve the right to refuse a sexual encounter you don't want.
Therefore, it's not unfair for a woman to have preferences that don't easily accept behavior more common among people diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome into the most intimate parts of her life, and that's OK!
No doubt you have some preferences too, even preferences that make you not easily accept certain other behaviors into nthe most important parts of your life, and that's OK too!
I made it clear that I was responding to the statement "I know some aspies who frequently say the most inappropriate and offensive things about - and to - their girlfriends..." by quoting that immediately before I said the rest of my post.
The rest of my post began with "Those poor girlfriends. Why do they stay with people who do things that hurt them?" This obviously *doesn't* include *other* NT women, who *aren't* those poor girlfriends mentioned in what I quoted, who stay with Aspie men.
For starters, no doubt some *other* Aspie men and Aspie women, who *aren't* the Apsies mentioned in what I quoted, *don't* say the most inappropriate and offensive things about - and to - their girlfriends and boyfriends in the first place! :)
Rthat it's not even calling him a bad boyfriend (even if someone else accuses you of doing that) when you go lick your wounds! It's calling recognizing that having him for a boyfriend is *bad for you* even though he still could turn out to be a good boyfriend *for someone else*.
You don't shouldn't have to keep dating someone just because someone else who doesn't have the same preferences as you do tells you that he or she is "intoxicating" or whatever. Nobody should have to!
"It's recognizing that having him for a boyfriend is *bad for you* even though he still could turn out to be a good boyfriend *for someone else*"
He struggles with relationships, intimacy, physical contact. He, like so many of the men who have been described on this site, also struggled with intercourse. Everything was fine, and he maintained an erection and was comfortable with oral sex, but would lose his erection on approaching intercourse.
Why, then, was this not the case with his previous girlfriend but it is the case with me. He said that I sometimes make him uncomfortable.
I have honestly never felt so rejected and unappealing as I do at the moment. I realise I must not take any of this personally but I can't NOT take it personality.
He admitted he believes he is an Aspie, so then would the emotional issues not manifest themselves with all the women he has relationships with or were they particularly acute with me?
Gavin, if you possibly can, please try to explain this to me. I am already so bereft and wounded, you could not possibly wound me any more. I want to understand what's happened. I feel as if I've been caught in a twister.
Thank you, Waterloo
There is nothing ever quite like a first love. It's the same as the first time you drink a coke or the first time you taste chocolate. You can spend your whole life chasing that first taste but you'll never ever get it back.
The reason? It's all about setting your expectations.
It's the same with films. A sequel could be better in so many ways than the original but the audience usually won't think so. If you look at the films where the sequel is considered better, they are not only vastly better films - they're also very, very different.
Love is the same, smiles and kisses are the same. Everything pales in comparison with the first - even though it's probably an overall better experience.
For most people, you can simply get them to "let go" of their past. They can "forget" a little - and move on. For aspies however, it's quite a different thing. We often remember everything. How we felt at the time, textures, sights and sounds. Even worse, our minds are often analytical and constantly make comparisons for us whether we want to or not.
Don't feel sad that you can't stir in your man the sorts of feelings that he remembers. It's not your fault at all. It's the fault of his expectations.
He needs to learn that the goal he seeks is now unattainable and that it's unfair to hold you to such an impossible benchmark.
"It's recognizing that having him for a boyfriend is *bad for you* even though he still could turn out to be a good boyfriend *for someone else*"
isn't just about the Aspie condition, it's about the *human* condition no matter if a human being is Aspie or NT or something else.
Nobody can be a good boyfriend for absolutely anyone who wants a boyfriend! Nobody can be a good girlfriend for absolutely anyone who wants a girlfriend!
"I have honestly never felt so rejected and unappealing as I do at the moment. I realise I must not take any of this personally but I can't NOT take it personality."
I totally understand that you can't NOT take it personally either! I also can't promise that you will be romantically accepted and sexually appealing to another man, because I'm a woman myself and I can't make a man keep that promise for me (like how some people have insisted me that there's a guy out there for me, but none of them asked me out themselves).
I *can* say that you are a worthwhile human being! Being rejected by, and being unappealing to, that guy doesn't mean you're a bad person! Even if you're not the person your ex wants to date, it's *still* entirely *possible* that you'll find someone else who is both attracted to you and who attracts you himself!
Even if you turn out to be like me (nobody who attracts me is attracted to me and vice versa), you still deserve *better* than having to put up with being in a bad relationship (and while being in a good relationship can feel better than being single, being single can still feel a ton better than being in a bad relationship)!
What, to an Aspie, is reminiscing, a triggered memory, and an obsession a current GF should worry about?
The difference here is that when the NT man decides to stay he doesnt change these behaviours towards the one he loves...he still shows her he loves her.
An Aspie man on the other hand puts on this same show. He does what hes seen on TV and in the movies and in general life around him and hides his real quirks and behaviours...until he marries you that is. then it all comes crashing out of him. And you are trapped...and fooled...and devasted.
At least thats my experience. Dated 5 and a half yrs...knowing he was Aspie but loving his little quirks and differences and helping him through many things but then I married him...and he got distant...and nasty...and quirkier...and sex stopped...and he told me when I asked where my BF went "I dont know. Im comfortable now. Get used to it coz this is me."
Yeah...thats my experience and that of the hundreds of other women on the TWO support groups for wives of Aspies Im on. There are medical papers written about it.
So...no offense to Aspies (I worked with kids with Aspergers and have friends with it too who I love dearly)...but its not NT men who do the most acting during courtship. Its men with AS.
My Aspie boyfriend and I have fallen out - over what is, I believe, an enormous miscommunication. I have tried contacting him and he rarely replies. I invited him out and he hasn't replied to my email.
I'd like to think he is 'burning inside' for me and is simply unable to communicate that, but what I actually think is that he simply doesn't care. He's done.
Unless he gives me a chance to ask him, meet him and chat with him, I will never know. And he's not giving me that chance."
I dated a guy for almost 3 months.I broke it off with him, and I'm starting to think it probably was due to miscommunication. He tried to call me quite a bit, but I never answered. At the time I was just in to much pain. There has not been a day over the last 3.5 months that I have not thought of him or cried over the loss of him. Don't think that he doesn't think of you. It's possible that he doesn't, but it is also possible that he does very much and just doesn't know what to do or he thinks to much time has past.
Do you know any divorced Aspie?
How did they cope with the divorce?
Did it take a long time for them to move on? Or did they ever move on?
If they did, how are they with their new mate now?
Is their previous relationship affects their current relationship?
My boyfriend is an Aspie, I'm totally in love with him.
He was married before for over 8 years, he married at very young age(He's now 31, and I'm 30). He got divorced about 1 year a go. He said his ex-wife left him for another man, and took all of their savings with her. They have no kids.
We had started to get serious & talk about marriage lately, and he even gave me a certain time-frame in his mind.
But somehow, I feel uncertain about it. I feel clueless. The problem is:
1) I often found him ranting about his ex-wife, even cursing her in front of everybody. From the frequency, seems like either he really hates her, or he still loves her & hasn't over her yet.
2) I feel like a yo-yo emotionally. He'd toss me & take me back over & over again. I don't know how to make him understand about how I feel. I did try to tell him several times, but he seems like doesn't care, or doesn't have a clue about what he did.
In the beginning, he was very intense in getting in touch with me (I live abroad & we're doing long-distance relationship). But now he seem to changed. There are days when he would refuse to answer my calls or reply my emails, and prefer to talk to me (and his friends) through Twitter instead (especially during & following his frequent meltdowns).
When he does answer my calls or doing video chat with me, he's often busy "multi-tasking" with his work, but at the same time he kept on talking about meeting me (he's coming to see me in April, so he said), planning our future together, having me by his side, etc.
I love this man, and truly wish we can make this work together, but I dont/cant understand him.
During his "silent" days, he'd literally talk to the whole world on twitter, except me. That's often the only way I could keep up with what's going on with him.
And then when he's back in the "talking" mood, he'd shower me with all the sweet words & make me feel like I'm the center of his world again.
With the way he treats me now (shutting me out & pulling me back in repeatedly), I doubt if we can end up having a great time together when we meet in April, let alone end up in staying together in marriage.
The more I think about us, the more I feel miserable. I've hopes for us, but I've doubts too.
I'll take a shot at this since I'm an Aspie who divorced and then remarried.
How did I cope with my divorce from my first wife? Not very well! While any divorce involves mistakes made by both parties, I now realize that most of the mistakes were made by me (though I certainly didn't see it that way at the time).
My biggest problem in terms of ALL my romantic relationships, including the one with my ex-wife, is that, as two people interact with each other, it impacts both individuals and they both change somewhat. I have great difficulty with change and, when the relationship changed naturally, I didn't know how to deal with it. So, I dealt with the change badly!
In time, I met someone new (my current wife of 27 years), but I put her through hell for our courtship period and the first 7 years or so of our marriage. Part of the problem was that I kept reliving my first failure and I decided that this second relationship would fail too! I also had a great deal of trouble when the natural changes came to our relationship.
The fact that my wife Della & I have been married for 27 years (and we're still going strong) is a testament to her, not me. She refused to give up on this strange fellow she married and it is her compassion and patience that allowed our relationship to navigate through troubled waters and come out the other side remarkably unscathed.
Her love for me and devotion to our relationship has helped me to turn the corner, so to speak. I know that I'm still not the easiest person to live with, but I am now able to do a better job holding up my end of our partnership. I am a better person today because of her!
I believe my ex-boyfriend is an Aspie. A friend repeatedly suggested that he was one, based on some stories I'd told her, like:
My ex recounted when he was 5, he gave his teacher a present; she went to hug him, and he RAN to the other side of the room. Also, his mother would tuck him in at night as a child, and tell him she loved him. He could never bring himself to respond back.
After I researched 'Aspergers and affection', I sat there for hours, crying, because everything sounded so familiar.
My boyfriend was in his early 30's when I met him, and I was the first girl he'd ever kissed. He said he never could tell if a girl was interested in him.
He was the most intelligent, funny, childlike, sweet, thoughtful, articulate and kind man I'd ever dated. Also the most awkward, gawky and goofy, albeit in a funny way.
He was very stable, worked at the same company for ten years, visited his parents once a week. Once when we were first dating, he left my friends' wedding reception to go watch football with his parents, which he did every Sunday, and which astounded me.
His lack of affection could be exasperating. Even after 5 years, he would almost never initiate a hug. I remember once when I sobbed over a traumatic event. Although he sat next to me, he made no move to comfort me, put his arm around me, or hold me.
Sometimes, when I'd hug him or cuddle with him, he'd make odd little goofy noises. I asked him why he did that, and he said he wasn't sure how to respond, when I touched him, or what he was supposed to do.
We saw each other once weekly, due to our schedules. He never once said he missed me.
After over 5 years, I asked him to consider moving in together, and he didn't want that, as he was happy seeing me once a week.
I suggested we break up, to which he didn't respond, but he did mention later that evening: "If we ever did break up, and started seeing other people, we could go on double-dates together." Which is NOT what a woman who has asked to share her life with you, wants to hear.
He kept inadvertently saying things that made it worse. I suggested we not contact each other for a few days after the breakup, wound up missing him, and called. He said he'd almost not answered the phone, because he'd gotten to a point where he felt like he could deal with being alone, and could get used to it again. He apologized the next day, but saying honest, yet hurtful things like that, kept hurting me and making me withdraw.
I've cried every week, pretty much over the last year, that he made only feeble, awkward, or completely non-existent attempts to contact me to discuss anything, or 'win' me back.
His birthday was recently, so I sent him an ecard after 7 months of no contact. Which has hurt me all over again, because it SEEMS that he's fine without me.
We both admitted we missed each other, and I don't feel like we ever talked things through.
Don't know if I'm improperly 'diagnosing' him as an Aspie.
I miss him, but think I deserve better. Although, if he is an Aspie, I wonder if we can talk things through.
I thought I made peace with us not being a couple, but guess I haven't. Help?
Many thanks for listening. -Shuvani
It sounds like you've suffered quite a bit and that if you had understood what was going on at the time, things may have ended very differently.
I guess the questions to ask are; Have you been seeing anyone since you broke up? ...and has he?
You might find that he hasn't seen anyone. You were a part of his life which ended. He is probably sad about that but doesn't understand that that he could have changed it.
Depending upon his age and openness, he may or may not be ready to start working towards a different kind of life.
You will be able to influence him but you won't be able to "change" him. If you think you can live with that then he might be the one for you, if not, then it's best to move on.
I was widowed 17 months ago after 34 years of marriage and it took me 11 months to get my "sea legs" back and think about finding another love. I went online and met a man and fell head over heels. I noticed right away that he was a little "quirky" but we all have our own ways and I felt a bond with him, maybe because I had feel so unbelievably lonely and was glad I'd found a man who appeared interested in me. The first month was greath, though some of the things he said to me wounded me to the core ("I still love my second live-in girlfriend and talk to her and I'd do anything for her" and "My second live-in girlfriend was a 10! Yeah, she was a 10!" (I'm a 7 at best.) And he wouldn't understand why that was hurtful. He's ramble for 90 minutes about mountain climbing, his passion. I'd say something that was important to me and he'd answer with dead silence. Then my Mom died and it was a slow progression and I started having panic attacks, was diagnosed with caregiver PTSD (from my husband's battle with cancer), depression, anxiety (a family condition unfortunately). I broke up with this man because I couldn't take the extra pressure, the loneliness I actually felt WITH him. He never told me he had Asperger's but I figured it out, read about it online, and he had almost every one of the hallmarks/symptoms. For the month we were separated he emailed constantly and because I truly cared for and loved this man, because I missed him so desperately, I answered. He said he thought I threw away the opportunity to find true happiness. So I gave him another chance. Then he put conditions on it. Said he was too busy with work, his "activities" and his mother coming to visit for two weeks and said we'd have to wait 30 days to resume our relationship. WHAT??? You've been begging me, pleading with me, and when I agree, you think it's OK to just hold me off in a corner for 30 days? So I asked for a compromise - email or give me a quick call in the morning, call me at night and we'll meet for one hour once a week for coffee. On the second night he didn't call until 9:30pm but by that time I thought he'd blown me off again and when he did call I told him it was late and I was tired and good-night and I hung up. We blasted emails back and forth several times the next day. He didn't get it. I didn't get it. I called him crying asking him to please call me and he ignored the message. I am so devastated and I just can't seem to get past this. I wish he'd been honest enough to tell me about his condition because all along I thought I was unreasonable, needy, insecure to the max and I blamed myself for the failure. He also had trouble maintaining an erection during intercourse, but not during oral sex. He told me it was because he hadn't had sex in so long (although he'd recently broken up with a long-time girlfriend), or that it was because he was "out of shape." I don't know if he was lying to me or lying to himself. He was a very proud man and I think he was ashamed of his AS, but the wounds he left me with are worse than any I've ever had from anyone else. I just don't know how to get over him. I feel so sad.
In fact, "wired differently", was one of the first words I used to describe him in a seemingly neutral conversation we had. I was driving him home, and all of a sudden he started describing, with specific details, the traffic patterns, why certain drivers stay on a lane, how that related to their "aggressiveness" in driving...etc...he also knew exactly where some of the pot holes were, and just seemed to know that piece of the road like the back of his hand. I thought it was different, but interesting.
On another occasion, I picked him up for dinner and noticed that he was making a type of a "fist", while mildly and repetitively rubbing the inside of his index finger with his thumb. I thought "maybe he is a bit anxious with this date". Being my "chatty" self, I told him I had got an interview for a great position...it took him a few minutes to respond. Unknowingly, I looked at him smiling and said..."humm...please say something"...he did...he said "i'm just thinking here...how did you found this job. Does your current employer know that you're looking? I'm asking because i also want to change my job but don't know how I can do it..."
Most of the time, it was me trying to engage him without overwhelming. I managed to identify a few things that he was interested in and he would talk way more. I loved it when he talked. So intelligent and poised.
There were many other instances that made me think of the "wired differently" description, but never that he was an aspie (I still don't know for sure). He has a very statuesque and somewhat rigid posture. He sometimes stares a lot, but at unexpected things. Very perceptive (almost uncanny).
Nonetheless, I very much like this man. I would like to get closer while still respecting his "world". I too like my alone time, to the point that some of my friends have told me I'm a bit weird. I've managed to get in his world just a bit, that means...he talked...about things that matter to him (or bother him).
(more on next post)
He's helped me with some PhD application things. I wrote my statements of purpose and he proofread and gave me feedback as well. He is so kind, and sensitive in his own way.
One of the things I appreciate the most, which I think is what "bothers" some people the most is the fact that he is BLUNT. COMPLETELY HONEST. Whether you can hear that and not take it personally is a different matter. I'll take direct honesty any day over "lies". I have my own reasons.
We dated for some time. Then we didn't date (no drama...we just stopped). We kept in touch throughout and he seems to like that I reach out to him.
Then...we went on another date. I know that he feels really comfortable around me, he enjoys the company...he wants to stay around even when I have to leave...BUT...then it's back to "withdrawal". He is so different face to face, than he is on phone/e-mail. He is extremely formal when he writes.
I finally told him...after ONE YEAR that I liked him and gave him a specific list of attributes as to the "why". He is very rational. We still talk...but all he said was "it's ok to be upset. We want different things. etc" And we still talk to this day...and he managed to give me some very meaningful compliments since then. I AM PUZZLED.
My question is...I have never asked him, or introduced the idea of Aspergers to him. Would it be completely out of line, or offensive if I approached it somehow? I'd love to be his friend, at least.
PS: he has been climbing at a rock gym for over 10 years. I have been at the same gym for about 1 year. He told me he doesn't know anyone at the gym. Never talked to anyone there. The other day, one of the people who work at the front desk, described him to me (different story for another day). She was very nice and respectful, but that's when I realized he may actually have Aspergers and it's not only me trying to come up with an excuse.
I apologize for the long entry and appreciate any feedback.
He's much better than what I've read on here. He seems to have put me in the center of his scheme of things, and is obsessive compulsive about talking to me- every single day- as we do home school together.
He's been abused by his father most his life, and taken for granted by many people- and says that he's never felt like this about anyone before- he was drawn to me, out of all the other people.
True, sometimes he can be a little inappropriate given the circumstances like I'll be showing him things that I know he likes and instead of paying attention to the picture itself he pays attention to the background like instead of commenting on me in the picture he's like LOL what's the person doing in the background. And im like did you even see me...or did you just look past me.
He's a complete gentlemen, he calls me his baby or baby girl all the time. Calls me by my nickname. He is sweet to the point it could have been straight out of a disney movie.
He doesn't talk to his friends anymore because he states that he's used to talking to me- he doesn't want to talk to them anymore.
He seems extremely happy too, happier than I ever remember seeing him.
I think he's got the mildest aspergers I've ever seen. And even though I have my own struggles, I try to support him as much as possible and try to look at him as a normal person- as my boyfriend- and not as somebody who suffers from aspergers.
To be honest, sometimes, I forget altogether.
He often says how he thinks god sent me to him, since he would always pray for somebody to come along.
He's had horrible girlfriends in the past. But he was never actually serious about them.
I found one of his comment's odd that how after he met me, he'd put my face over the current girlfriend's face because he was so scared to ask me out- afraid I would say no- that he would simply pretend the girls were me.
I felt sort of bad for the girlfriends.
I'm extremely sensitive though, which he likes because he doesn't know how to handle emotions and he likes the fact that I'm so emotional. He makes really cute comments- he makes me feel incredibly loved.
And it's funny because growing up with a neglectful family and a brother with aspergers- sometimes I think that even just a little affection that I get from someone- goes a loooong way for me.
He likes that he can sit down and share his world of video games with me since I'm such a gamer having been the only girl in a household of all boys. He says he often wishes it were just me and him and the whole world would disappear.
I try to give him as much of his world as possible, because honestly, he still reminds of a little kid at times- and I try to enjoy his own little world as much as possible.
I find that sharing things with him that he enjoys, makes good responses and it makes him feel like I listen to him. He even sometimes gets excited and will say "you remember me saying i liked this!"
we've been together for almost two years now.
eventually we hope to live together and have kids. at first he wasn't thrilled about kids.
Now he's been taking part of the naming process- he likes the name Logan.
I need some advice on where to go with my current on and off aspie bf:
He seemed to be doing the thing you did before - that he couldnt juggle the time between workload from Uni, his time with friends/his own hobbies and me, and now he is completely shutting down on me.
After reading your blog I am wondering what is the best thing to do? Should I give him the space and time he needs, but is there any way to keep in touch if he is shutting down?
I don't know how long it will be, and how much it will takes, I am just puzzled. I still love him, but I don't know what to do now :(
Just after some advice. My husband shut down on me. He is an Aspie. It has been hard since we got married. I love him and I know he loves me too. It is just that I am finding it hard to come to understand how one minute, he could not live without me and hated me going to work. Now this? He has said that we can spend the weekend every other weekend when I don't have my daughter together. But that he can't do phone calls, text. I will get the odd text from him, but if I text him I am pressuring him. So confused. Do I walk away? Is he just mean and self centered? Or as you say, can't calculate time for me? When I'm at our old home, where he lives, he say's I make it warm. He acknowledges that I am everything he every wanted still. This has dragged on since early January and I am going mad, with grief, longing and feeling used. He hides that he loves me from his friends. Three months down, with no end in sight. Please, any advice
But a few days ago, I got on the phone to my best friend soon after he came home from work; he started cooking. While very friendly a few minutes ago, all of a sudden, he started getting really irritated saying i was speaking too loud until i spoke in almost a whisper. But even after that he started becoming aggressive and poked me furiously telling me to get off the phone, which offended me (he'd never do anything violent before), so i ignored him. 10 minuted after i'd started speaking to my friend he eventually grabbed the phone out of my hand and said 'Go home. Leave. Now' (it was 11 p.m. and he knows it'd take me ~3 hours to get home). I was totally shocked ad on the verge of crying. He'd never done anything even similar to this before. Our relationship had been going so well - he'd always tell me he loves me and how beautiful I was and about how he loves me more than anything and how I was the only 1 who loved him like that too and kept bringing up me marrying him every few days (he's 24, I'm 21), told me how important taking my virginity was to him, help me with my work, spend a lot of money on me - up till that day. I know he was stressed (it was his 2nd day at new work, he is on bad terms with his family and best friend and he'd run out of anti-depressant medicine), but it was still to upsetting so, I got up to leave, since that's what he told me to do. He tried to stop me soudned apologetic for a sec, realised i'm still leaving,t hen said 'if you leave now, we're done' and i said 'in that case, yes we are. i'm not up for being treated like this' - he was very angry. 10 minutes after i'd left he sent me a text saying 'it's incredibly impolite to talk n the phone when someone's cooking for you. it made me realise you're too immature for this relationship. Don't reply to this, try to contact me or come to my house ever again. We're done'. and blocked me from facebook. (i know his previous gf was 20 years his senior, she cheated on him and he may not have got over her yet, so maybe that's why he keeps saying i'm immature i.e. comparing me to her, even though he's the immature/ unreasonable 1 here?)
Even though this break-up wasn't meant to happen and was just the heat of the moment, I know he's very stubborn, so he'll never contact me again and probably won't reply if i try to contact him. But I also know he loves me, i think, unless he's an incredibly good liar. What on earth was/ is going through his mind?? And what am i supposed to do now? I'm very distressed as he was my 1st and only relationship of 3 months, please help.
Please don't start doubting yourself. An Aspie e-friend of mine can't find a good word to say about any feature in my face - ever.I once won second place in a pageant and am still considered good-looking. He gushes compliments to other female e-friends who are nice, but nothing to go on about.... I found this carry-on very insulting, he told me "looks don't matter, it's personality and brains that's important"...yet sends me pics of celebrities he thinks are beauties and gushes about the great looks- of his friends and colleagues partners/wives. I have never in my life encountered such a man or attitude to my appearance...so don't think for a moment that you are a "7"...that reminds me of the song ' Two Out Of Three Aint Bad', it's offensive, and if that's how he feels that he should hold out for another "10" and you dear lady, should not stay around someone who will cause you to lose your self-respect and confidence. Because that is what happened to me and nobody is worth losing yourself for.Keep in mind that he is odd and so is his judgement of women.
"I learned how to be the sort of person she wanted"
this is why I freaking hate relationships, because there will always be sacrifices. I ain't sacrificing me for a steady fuck.
But i am somewhat less social than other people :p
So, part of me just wanted to type that all out in some sort of cathartic move... but I'd also really like someone's opinion. He's such a wonderful guy and we are/were growing together so well. We've expressed our feelings of love and committment to each other for over a year, while both working to move toward the ability to take our relationship further. We have both been on the same page with this all along... there hasn't been any new issues or disputes.
So, here are my questions:
1) For someone like him, who is not at all afraid of being direct, drop me and cut me off completely like that permanently?
2) Is giving him complete space (no texts/calls) the best thing to do?
3) would periodic uplifting texts be viewed as helpful to him?
4) Am I completely deluding myself to believe that he's just trying to find a way to get back on track financially, get a new computer, and get out from under the stress?
Thank you for taking the time to read this...
In a nutshell I don't know, if there's anything you can do, but I have some possibly useful feed back. 1) I suspect from your letter and relationship choice you also have AS. "Normal" people are simply not known to write such a balanced and detailed letter on any topic involving their feelings and wellbeing. So you might have a better understanding of this male than you realise. that said,
2) you obviously have less issues with stress and emotional communication and so may not realise what a weird space this can be.
I hesitate to offer a strategy in case all are destined to fail, and I hardly think advice that resembles stalking him is unethical. So- Id consider trying a non verbal approach like sending him an object that is supposed to advocate for you. such as a small gift.
Alternately consider that the very "progressing nicely" aspect of the relationship may have scared the crap out of him. Without communication it is hard to say "heck let's keep it low key" but if you do contact him consider not mentioning the long term intimacy gradient which is just scary if you have barely met preliminary intimacy hurdles anywhere else in your life. good luck !
17 days and counting without any word from him. I am losing hope, but at least I'm getting out of bed...
So you think I'm on the spectrum? Well, I do work with children who are... and frankly, I suspect everyone is somewhere on the continuum. I've never thought of myself that way... and I certainly don't possess the high IQ of a typical Aspie. Interesting thought. Maybe in all my free time these days I should check out one of the online tests.
Anyway, thank you for responding... I was beginning to fear that no one would. I'm having a really hard time with this and it just kills me not to have a definitive answer or closure or something that I can process.
Again, thank you for your thoughts...
We met about 10 years ago, we were roughly about the same age, with children also the same age. I had a boyfriend and was going through a uncertain time he had a girlfriend, I found out he was seeing a third girl, I ended it and married my boyfriend.
About 3 years ago, I found him through Facebook and contacted him again, we met and rekindled our "affair." I was hoped things would be different, but soon noticed the same pattern. It was a very intense affair but I got the feeling I was just his "fuck buddy" as we never went on a date we just met at his office.
I left my husband and moved into my own house, this didnt change anything in fact I probably saw less of him, however he did start to "let me in" and we began meeting at his home. We still didn't go on a date. After 6 months I moved back with my husband, but we carried on meeting.
After 3 years of this, I noticed he was contacting me only to reply to my emails, we never spoke on the phone or text. I got the feeling things were fizzling out even though he said we had a "connection" he never really let me close or told me that he loved me. If my emails were emotional and loving, he simply wouldn't reply.
He told me he was on the autistic spectrum, he is a businessman and it appears he runs his business 24/7 rather than have a close relationship, he puts all his efforts and time into his business, he was always "too busy" or "being pulled in all directions" which he thrived on.
Since I returned to my husband, he stopped inviting me to his home and we were back to meeting at his office.
Eventually he gave up his office and began working from home, we never met again. I contacted him a few times, asking if he had moved on or if he still wanted to meet but he wouldn't answer me, he couldnever explain himself, how he was feeling or wouldn't, I only ever wanted to know if he was interested still, but he couldn't even tell me that.
He did ask to see me and I agreed, but the day came and went with no contact, I emailed him and told him that I wouldnt contact him again as he was constantly letting me down and by this time I was confused as I just didnt know the situation, his feelings or if he had met someone else. I did get a reply, he apologised saying that he was busy and thought he had emailed me to look at "other options," he hadnt, despite my further emails that was the last I ever heard from him, no explanations, no goodbyes, no apologies, just silence.
It is the silence that hurts mostly, I just feel like I was nothing to him, but we had become very comfortable and familiar with each other, shared the same views and sense of humour. He has just cut me off after knowing each other on and off for 5 years.
I couldn't leave it that way and so I did send an email to him to wish him well and apologise if I had upset him in any way, I thanked him for some lovely memories, but that I was hurt over the way things had ended abruptly with no explanation, but that he would always have a place in my heart.
I think writing this has been cathartic, I feel tearful even though I realise it is just how he wanted it to be and probably doesn't feel the empathy I wanted him to feel. I can see now that I read too much into this. He had told me that he had come to a decision he wanted to be on his own and was unable to be in a relationship and enjoyed the freedom of our friendship and intimacy.
I am currently trying to put this experience to the back of my mind and pick up the pieces of my life from before our contact. He has obviously moved on now. I miss our contact, but I feel stronger as I dont have that confusion and uncertainty constantly with me and always thinking, will I hear from him, will I see him again? I did love him, but I guess he just didn't have the capacity to love me in return.
I used to get angry or cause a scene when I felt rejected, as he pressed some very painful buttons for me, but then I learnt to handle myself better. I must admit,though, it was nerve-wracking as I'd never know if I'd get a response which would be emotionally-affirming or just cold silence. I needed a more consistent connection than he could give. It was the inconsistency that was harder than anything, a bit like a roulette wheel. The pain didn't disappear with understanding, I just blamed myself less (even though he blamed me). I still tended to criticise him or complain when I felt horrible, hurt or disappointed, thinking that it was better to speak up than pretending these horrible feelings weren't there. His 'special interests' dominated his spare time and conversation and I found it increasingly hard to negotiate any time for us.
This last week, we had a difficult week. I had said that I was disappointed that he wasn't considering 'us' in his plans. Although he tried to be reassuring he later admitted that he had just decided to do what he wanted. He said he had had enough of me complaining or saying I was disappointed. At the end of this week of tension, we had a spat over something small, and then he finished our relationship. He agreed at the same time that he was having a melt down and that he only decided to split an hour before, after the spat, but said that he didn't enjoy my company any more. During the previous week, although it had been tense at times, we'd also had, what he agreed were wonderful times together, so this doesn't quite add up.
Its hard to make sense of it as the ending was so abrupt.
Previously when we've split I've missed him so much and usually blamed myself for getting too upset with him and eventually we've got together. But I think that would just make both of us unhappy so I should look around for someone who I can relax with because although I really want to be with him, he really isn't good for me, and obviously, I'm not good for him. But I just wish I could be more accepting of him and take his behaviour less personally...
Are they someone who makes a positive addition to your life, or do they detract from what makes you, you?
Are they a partner or a full time project?
Why do WE Choose them?
Just a few questions I can ask with t the benefit of hindsight as luckily for me he finished it and stopped me sacrificing my own needs, possibly for the rest of my life. That wouldn't have been good for anyone.
I see alot of letters of this sentiment, and as a woman I can relate, but as a person with AS, I feel that it's a false conflict- women write, essentially, that they're being harmed emotionally and psychologically by being in a relationship with a male with AS. But really I feel people are being harmed by their expectations of complete, verbalised intimacy. And by wanting all their needs met in one person. I know better than to demand of every person I know a defined synopsis of their exact feelings and inner world. but in "relationships" many people will keep on talking this point endlessly.
I've been in a relationship, or better saying, in a non-relationship for almost 2 years with a man I came to find out is an Aspie (I'm sure he knows nothing about AS). I feel deeply about him, but I am also lost, because he keeps giving me hope in some way and then withdraws. He does not like physical contact and seems not to care much about sex, and it hurts me a lot. We work at the same office and see each other in a daily basis for lunch as friends.
After having known each other for one year at work, we started "dating" for six months and he would come to my house once a week during this period. At that time I was not sure what kind of relationship we had, but I think he made it clear one day by calling us “lovers”. The word girlfriend was never spoken. He would never sleep over and preferred to go home very late instead. After six months I thought it was very awkward! I was never sure I’d see him the next weekend and one day, after emailing him suggesting we went somewhere on Saturday, he simply didn’t reply. I kept waiting for him to call to say something – even a “no”, but he did not. I phoned him, but he didn’t answer. I was devastated that he had acted like that, showing no consideration. The next Monday I saw him at the office and he was strange but said nothing about the weekend. One day I called him in MSN and asked what had happened and he said “Nothing. I just wanted to rest”. At that time I had no idea of what Asperger was and got astonished by his behavior. I retracted after that and a few days later he went for one month vacation and I had no news of him. After a while (months) he started emailing me to say some compliment and we started written communication till we met again at my home after 4 months. It was last January and since then, we talk in FB, see each other almost every working day for lunch with other friends, sometimes talk (write) of meeting outside office, but it never happens… He always comes with some excuse and we don’t meet. Sometimes he keeps me waiting for a call or message on Saturdays telling me if he’s coming (and he never comes). I resent him a lot in these occasions and feel bad about me for accepting this situation. My therapist says he’s an autistic and therefore is incapable of loving. I can tell he likes me in his strange way, but I need to be with him and to touch him. What can I do???? When I come closer, he gets cold with me. Please, I need some advice on this!!! I’m running out of ideas and I like him a lot! In fact I think I’m obsessed with him. It’s very hard to love an Aspie.
Clearly he loves you but his expression is different to yours. It's common for people with autism to not like cuddling, kissing or sex due to sensitivity issues. That doesn't mean that he doesn't love you - it simply means that there are some things that he finds uncomfortable.
One of the things that you both need to do is compromise. You need to accept less touch and he needs to accept more. It can work.
The "going home" bit is important too. He doesn't get why it would be good for him to stay at a strange place. Personally, I don't get those sorts of needs either but I know they're common in neurotypical (normal) people. I don't sleep well at different places and since you'll be sleeping rather than talking to him, it simply doesn't make sense for him to like awake all night trying to sleep when he could just as easily go home and get a good night's sleep in a comfortable and familiar bed.
Communication is the biggest problem in the Aspergers/Autism world. It impacts us in so many ways, for example saying "I love you" when you're not sure what love is and whether it's "love", "extreme like" or just plain happiness. For us, communicating "yes" means to quickly and loudly say "yes". Communicating "No" often means saying nothing at all - especially if you're not sure of the words to use - or if you think your response might provoke an uncomfortable confrontation.
By not replying to your email/text, he's saying No. You did ask "If he would like to go somewhere". It wouldn't have occurred to him to think that you'd be waiting on his answer. He's not doing it to hurt you, he just wouldn't have known.
It's not actually as hard as you think to love an aspie. It's just hard to get to good mutual communication. Once you have that, the rest will follow.
The best thing to do would be to go somewhere in your lunch break to talk about things. Start to agree on some rules. For example, a phone call at 7pm every Wednesday and one at 10am on Saturday (more often if you need it). All weekend activities have to be agreed on in full during the 10am Saturday conversation.
I know that it probably sounds like these rules will suck all the romance out of the relationship but I assure you, it's more likely to improve things.
I have been addicted to this blog for the past week or so, reading all inputs from all angles.
I'm hoping that you or some of your Aspie/NT followers can help me.
My story: 2.5 years ago I met the most beautiful, amazing man. I was tightly curled up in a cocoon afraid of letting myself be loved after a horrendous breakup a few years earlier. He helped me become a butterfly and for the most part we've had a wonderful relationship.
He's German, so many dogmatic, firm resolve issues I put down to this. We moved in together after a few short months. He is a high achiever, a scientist, internationally respected. I am successful, independent and very hard working. We lived very well together as we both got on with our 'stuff'. He however has routines that are non-negotiable, cost sharing structures that are rigid to the last receipt, our future plans were based on his focus...where we lived, what kind of house etc. To be fair I rolled in happily with this. He has two children whom I adore and who adore me. They do not live with us but we have them as often as possible. He is going through a horrendous divorce since I met him, I have always been supportive of the ups and down of this.
In the past year we have started to have problems as I have been feeling unappreciated, almost used. Despite my more than full time job (c60hrs a week), I keep the house, do the shopping, cook a meal every night. I would sometimes call on my way home from work suggesting that we go out for dinner as I was tired. he'd respond, it's OK I'll have a sandwich...but what about me?!!
Sarah....to be continued
The next day I left for 3 days for work. We started blasting emails at eachother, his were angry, complicated talking about money money, money. Mine were, why are you speaking like this, I cant take it. He accused me of acting, staging a game to make him change his mind. The weekend came and I went to my mothers. I pretended he was away with work so she wouldnt ask me any questions that I couldnt answer. I booked into a hotel for the Tues/Wed as we continued to blast emails. I didnt return home as I knew that we'd just end up in bed with nothing resolved. He went away again for work on Thursday-Tues and I went home to collect some clothes. I found a post it note with a girls name on the coffee table.
Sarah...sorry more to come
That was a month ago. On the Monday I send him an email full of how much I love him but cant continue without shows off appreciation for all I do for him, his children, our home, his work, divorce...always me doing....and after all I'd done, we had an argument and he was replacing me whilst I was still living with him! That he'd put the energy into this rather than us?? I heard nothing from him, not a word for 3 weeks. I was beside myself with pain. I then heard from him last week to advise me that his father had died the previous week! I was so hurt. I then received the memorial card, that had his ex wifes name on it! His father hated her! So, instead of calling me, he called her?!!
We spoke a few days ago, I know that he is all alone in this world. he has no real friends. No one that he could talk to about US. He has promised that he is not back with his wife, they just called a truce for the funeral and that he went on one date with the girl but he wouldnt be seeing her again. He said that we are over as he needs a stable home for a stable mind. he needs someone to mind and reassure him, someone to be there for him and his kids, without question....etc etc
I am so sorry to all of you for venting....and making this so long, but I'm trying to understand. It's all about his needs! What about me???
I love this man so much. I am now pretty convinced that he has AS. Though it would be a hard fight to get him to admit this, as in his mind he is the perfect catch.
I am a very caring and empathetic woman. I feel that had we known or suspected this that our behavior towards eachother could have been different. He tells me that we're over as we will have future conflicts due to his very character, but I believe that he blames his German-ness. I think it's more.
I know that he will be hell bent on meeting someone to help him cope, yet I know that as he'd seek for this very reason that it wouldnt work. I have so much respect, pride, love, desire for this man. Although my family and friends think him cold, I dont. I know that we shared a deep love.
My sister, a nurse, mentioned the other day that I should consider that he could have AS, as his behavior sounded off. She concluded that he either has AS or he is a warped terrible man. None of us believe this though.
So my questions;
Does it sound like he may have AS?
Could it be too late for us?
How do I handle things from here?
(PS. My father died last year and he left me and went home after the funeral. he sat at home on his own for two days before heading to germany to see his boys. That was our 1st big fight as I couldnt believe that he wouldnt stay by my side, that he wasnt there for me. Might this be why he didnt tell me about his Dad?)
My issue is my 4 small children. He loves them and they love him. He is doing very well adapting to that chaos as we have slept at his house for 2 weeks straight now, and he has mentioned that he doesnt know how to get ready for it and he may never be ready for it but he has been thinking we should live together. I want to live with him and I know with my hyper OCD and parenting it will be ok, but I am still so very scared that he will flip a switch one day and just kick us all out. I am in a position financially that I can care for my kids so its not that I would worry about being homeless...its that we would be moving into his home and I don't want to disrupt the kids like that if he decideds to just make us leave without working on it. I just wish I knew that it would be ok. Sometimes getting that *security* from an aspie is just the hardest thing...
I miss him alot some days I remember the good times and I just have to keep moving on it was probably the right for bothof us especially him I just wish I could apologise is all :(
When last year I broke up with my aspie boyfriend (4 year together) the very same month he began another relationship. And next month he began another one, with a woman from his office.
He never tried to contact me, even if he knew that I was going trough a surgery, not an attempt just to answer "did everything went fine or do you need some help ? "
He was dating with her colleague for two months and immediately moved to her house where they are now living together with her two children.
It is as if I never have existed in his life ! It's difficult for me to understand how you can start a new relationship without a "normal mourning time" in order to heal your soul from the wounds that any break up or loose leaves in your life.
So, sure an AS won't miss you
First off I love this man with every inch of my being, I honestly do, I openly tell him I love him, often, he's response "I care for you". He moans when I don't hurry to call/text/meet him but he's allowed to ignore my texts/calls/or failures to turn up for me.
One month we are on, the next we are off. Then we talk and then we don't.
For the most part he just wants a platonic friendship, I go along with this, and don't pressure him for anything, then, out of the blue he says that he wants me physically, so we meet, have sex! I say sex because to me it never feels like lovemaking, its very cold, but I accept it, if I try to touch his face gently try to communicate how much I love him he stops and goes rigid and says he wants to go home as he feels uncomfortable.a few hours after sex he will text me saying that he can't handle a relationship and he just bails out leaving me high and dry. This has happened 3 times now.
I have finally had enough. I can't stand the pain of he's mood swing and mind changes.
I feel broken, destroyed.
This clever,gentle, wonderful, quirky man, I will miss him with all of my heart and soul, but I just cannot go on like this anymore.
I have been in a "relationship" with a man for about one year. I do not wish to disclose any information on the blog but was wondering your take on it. I believe he does have Asperger's. He does seem to have many traits and since I began using some suggestions in communicating, things have been better. Is there a way I can email you to describe more details about the relationship? Thank you so much.
I also remember saying things way too bluntly which I will always regret like when I responded "no" to "god, wasn't this the best sex you ever had?" -and so on and on and on.
In my current life, I try and will try to be mindful of these things, if I ever get another try at things.
I'm still mourning my loss and am in no hurry to rush into something else for fear in resulting in another catastrophe.
We had been together for nearly 25 years. I'm not saying she was entirely without fault, but I truly had no notion as to the root of mine 'till very recently.
She views me as having an uncurable condition. I have more faith in myself.
But reading all these stories of woe here sinks my heart, truly.
If only I could go back and restart with the knowledge I now have. But now time has ticked away. Life has more gone by than not. And it's like by the time people like us finally find the key, if we do, by that time, we may discover that we have lost the lock, because time may have run out.
So, the only thing I feel I may have left in myself is to warn fellow Aspies of my experience, so that less people in the future are hurt, both Aspie and NT. That at least my failure may help turn their experience into a success before I die. That if it took most of my love life to realize that it was but one big failed experiment (albeit with some good times) that it may at least shed some light as to the root causes that led it down that path so that others may build on this experiment to achieve greater and greater successes.
It wasn't 'till recently that there wasn't hardly any awareness regarding any of this. So there potentially is hope.
warn internet users particularly those in search of solution to their
problems to beware of and avoid comments about spell caster that can
use their magical power in helping you out with your problems. I don't
want anyone to be fooled because i was a victim of this fraudsters
who claimed to be spell casters. I am Wimberly William and i was having
a difficult time in my relationship as my wife couldn't give birth to a
child. Although my wife and i loved each other very much as it were.We kept on
hoping and for 6years there weren't any sign of breakthrough .As days
goes by,i will always weep because at that time i was really down.
Even though my wife tried to always be by my side,only time would
tell as we couldn't cope with pressure coming from friends and she had to leave
me for another man. I was now left to face my problem alone even
though my mom would always talk to me and console me on phone. Things
went from bad to worse when i was sacked from the private organization
i was working because been happily married was a criteria that was
needed and that i was now lacking owing to my failure to have a child that has made my
wife leave me for another man leaving me single. I kept on
searching and hoping i would find a solution to my problem but there
wasn't any coming. I contacted lots of spell caster as i saw them on
the internet but all were scams as they demanded money from me
frequently and nothing happened. i had to relocate from Texas city
United state to Jamaica where my mom was residing and also because i
became racially abused because of my color .I spent 4 months with my
mom and together we kept on looking for solution still to no avail.
There came a faithful day when i met my high school mate who knew i
was happily married and living in Texas city United state with my
wife and had to ask why i flew back to Jamaica. I explained my
problem to her and with sincere desire in wanting my problems solved
she led me to DR JAMIN ABAYOMI. Although i was doubtful but soon as i
explained my problem to him,he laughed and gave me a maximum of
72hours for my wife to come back and for she go give birth. I
did all i was asked to do which included me traveling back to Texas
city United state. I traveled back to Texas city united state,on my
arrival during the early hours of the morning,my phone rang and guess
who?it was my wife who called asking for my forgiveness and saying
she was coming back home. She came few hours later and on her knees she
pleaded for forgiveness. Although it was a tough decision for me to
make because of all the pains i have been through. I love her and
needed her back so i had no option but to forgive her. We sat together
and while she was resting her head on my chest we had romantic
conversation and talked about things that we have never spoken about
and like husband and wife the urge came to have sex and we had sex for
a very long time that day. The next day which was still within the
72hours given by DOCTOR JAMIN ABAYOMI she felt something different in her
body and immediately she went for a check up and to our greatest
surprise,she was pregnant. How possible could this be but it happened
and am very thankful also my skin color that made me racially abused
was changed to the preferred and now we are now happily married again
and no racially discrimination. All thanks to DR JAMIN ABAYOMI for his
ARE YOU FACED WITH SIMILAR PROBLEM OR ANY KIND OF PROBLEM.PLEASE KNOW
THAT DR JAMIN ABAYOMI isn't on the internet so kindly contact him via
I'm sorry about your experience. Being aspie accounts for some difficulties, but IMHO it does not account for intent. From what you say, he did not regard you well.
I would suggest not making such a blanket statement against all aspies because of your horrible experience.
Even with the hurdles that aspies may present, one things can ring true and that would be the matter of intent. If the aspie really cared about you that would ring true despite the social clumsiness. What you have described here goes far beyond that. It reads to me like he would have been a bad mate, aspie or not, based on his regard to you.
I'm sorry, but he does not represent all aspies. He just happened to be a person that was very wrong for you, who also happened to be aspie. I'm sure, had he been well intended towards you you would have probably forgiven many a faux pas. But more than anything, this appears to be a matter of intent.
Best wishes on your next relationship. I am an aspie myself.
I can only think about how he would've been with the kids. Those poor children. And if one died? No support or emotion. Evil.
That person may never read this but let me make one thing perfectly clear. Those things that aspies say that come off as offensive are the exact same things that normal perople THINK but lie about.
Dont act like girls are being abused and misstreated just because they arnt being lied to and manipulated. Some woman, the smart ones i might add, become aware that even though the truth can sting from time to time, its worth sacrificing for complete and total honesty.
Do the dumb woman who break up with overly honest aspies, have fun living a lie. As they say, ignorance is bliss.
omg, this is a complex and complicated question. As someone who is on the spectrum I will speak from my own experience. He might not fully grasp what his feelings are towards you. He might not make the same associations of sex and commitment as you do. If he is uninitiated he may even be very timid about sex with someone else and it may seem confusing. He may fear to make the initial sex move for fear of not knowing what to do and the emotions which he has difficulty expressing may be too intense. So, my recommendation is that you be gentle, and not too abrupt. Also try to be as tolerant and forgiving as possible of his initial missteps. They can be as frustrating to him as they are too you, even when they don't seem to be.
He obviously wants you around, but he may not be fully aware of the extent and be careful not to seem too clingy. U want him to seek you, not feel overwhelmed.
Be prepared for blunt responses to the types of questions you should never ask an Aspie. For example, I actually committed this atrocity: I was asked by my parter at the time: "Boy! Was that the best sex you ever had?!" And my socially inept response was: "No, I remember when I was with Markela that... ... ... ...and also when I did ... with Gidget that ... ... ..." And, of course, I was being so sincere about it. Well, that was a nail in the coffin for that relationship.
Also, the environmental conditions like temperature and humidity and sheet thread count and material all count. Be prepared to be attentive to minutiae.
There's so much more, but that can get u started. xD
I have surpassed much of this, but it took and is taking a considerable effort on my part, starting with self-awareness. Hey, at least I am able to write you this response! :-D
Yes it will take time and effort and I have been very patient with him. He has had a lot of issues with work as no one understands him. He talks to another lady every day who works in his department but another town. He told me yesterday she didn't call him and he knew something was wrong and he called her at work and cell. They talk daily. She is married with kids- should I be worried.
He emailed me today with the greeting hi buttercup/plum.
Thanks so much for taking your time and replying sincerely. This was very helpful. I just hurt because I love him so much and not sure how he feels or if he can feel love for me. He has had a lot of difficulty at work as people misunderstand him. He also talks to another lady everyday that works in his department but lives in another town. He told me yesterday that she didn't call and he knew something was wrong and so he called her at work and she left early so he called her on her cell. Should I be worried? She is married with 3 kids. He didn't invite her for the weekend. Today he emailed me and said hi buttercup/plum. I feel so helpless and am so struggling with this. Any more advice would be welcomed and appreciated. Not sure how to even approach sex. Do I ignore it or what? I'm shy to.
The fact that he called u plum and buttercup is an extremely good sign because he's really doing what he can at the moment to express affection in the best way he can. This often doesn't come easily, even if he feels endearment. I have always had issues uttering terms of endearment. That, IMO, is quite the breakthrough and you should consider yourself very privileged!
Regarding the woman with three kids, perhaps you should be worried, but likely for other reasons. I doubt that he is trying to get into her pants. Aspies have morals like anyone else. I doubt that he would want to break her home. But, here's the thing: Me, as an aspie, have been known to myself as, at times, having boundary issues, AND also being a bit to perseverant, which can be construed as obsessive or totally misinterpreted in other ways. While typical people err on the side of caution and shun away from friendships with married people we tend not to, but this doesn't mean there is a sexual pursuit, just not that social boundary. This can be misconstrued. Now, add to that, if someone doesn't respond or answer to something, I have to control myself a bit because my tendency is to pursue that person by air, land or sea and if they still seem to have gone missing, then I may be inclined to call the Civil Air Patrol to initiate a Search and Rescue mission. This overboard-ness can be further misconstrued, with a regular friend, let alone a married person of the opposite gender.
There are so many ways in which aspies can get into so much social trouble in their interpersonal relationships and at work that it can "make your head spin". xD
So, in a way, if you become close to him and gain his confidence, it may serve him well that u become his sonar in navigating such waters. You may be surprised at the insight he may provide in areas you never might have imagined feasible. So u may be able to complement each other in different ways.
Imagine someone who is blind, but with an extremely acute sense of hearing and someone else who is deaf but with an acute sense of sight and smell. Put the two people together and you may end up with a very strong team.
But, as you can see, with him it's not just a matter of miscommunication, it's also his actions that can throw people with usual expectations on a loop.
My pleasure. Best wishes
You dont know how much i appreciate your feedback and guidance.
I spoke to my fellow last night and we discussed this lady with 3 weeks who calls him daily and he said that he doesnt love her and that he does enjoy talking to her like his other males that he mentioned. He said that his emotions are shallow and he doesnt know what love is. He did say that he didnt bring up her name in conversation becuase he didnt like to see me hurt or sad. He even mentioned when he is asked about whether he loves his mother- that he doesnt know how to answer that. Is this Aspie capable of love and a relationship. I have said to him in a joking manner that i didnt mind if he spoke to this lady as long as the understanding there was that he was mine. He didnt argue the point and i said it to see if he would- to get a better sense.
Any insight would be helpful. Thank you kindly
Glad I could be of some help.
I can almost assure you that his emotions aren't shallow, but rather his perceptions of them and his ability to communicate them. The fact that he didn't want to hurt your feelings speaks a lot. He may need some patient and subtle coaching on what love is. It will certainly conflict with his logical side and part of it he may be shunning because love seems irrational and unexplainable and we like to keep things as neat as possible in our heads. It may take him a while before he embraces chaos as part of the natural order but once he does it may seem as though he has found the key. Hopefully by that time he won't have misplaced the lock.
It's like learning to be a sea captain, first one has to learn to navigate peaceful waters before moving on to the choppy seas. It requires patience, determination and constancy of purpose, all qualities that we have, except perhaps the patience one. lol
These all become possible if the journey and outcome become our special interest. The magic is in persuasively enticing us into it becoming our special interest.
I was having serious issues with my boyfriend, My problem was very difficult and it made me come to a very close to giving up, my lover suddenly changed when he traveled to Germany for a business purpose, he wasn't returning my calls, i never knew he has started cheating on me, he was hurting me in many ways, when i found out, A good friend of mine recommended TO this SPELL CASTER great zula, I was very skeptical about using a love spell i when i finally gave a try, to my surprise after 4 days that I had my spell cast by great zula, I was absolutely shocked that my boyfriend called me to apologize to me, he knelt on his knees begging me to take him back, email@example.com brought my lover back to me he is the one of the cheapest and best service i have ever seen anywhere. finally my lover returned to me. we are back and happier than ever. MY LOVER JUST GAVE ME A RING LAST WEEK.
You have been an angel for me as i navigate this. I had an ecard from my fellow and it read Happy Birthday Sweetheart, One tree can start a forest, one smile can start a friendship, one touch can show love and care, one person like you can make life worth living". I was so touched and was over the moon. Then i thought maybe he thinks this is a friendship type card. I have told him that i love him and being apart is hard and that he should move closer so we could be together. He says he knows i want that and maybe some day he will move nearer, but he has to go where he has to go and see what happens. I feel like I am getting so many mixed messages and its all over the place. I feel like i am on an emotional roller coaster. I know he has a lot going on now with work. He was out for supper with some of the girls he works with and he told them someone (that was me) was visiting and that he wanted directions to go places and they drew him a map. It seemed like he was discreet to them on who was visiting. He likes to keep his personal life seperate. I feel like I should just come out and tell him I want more than friends but am scared that it will be not what I want to hear and i will have to disconnect which will kill me but this roller coaster is hard to. Maybe I need to understand what will be the least painful for me.
Any insight or feedback is appreciated. You are the only one who can understand how i feel and also how he is with aspergers.
Be careful not to create your own roller coaster. That was the sweetest card. He is obviously more than a friend. But a relationship based on friendship is a beautiful thing, which it is. You may be taking it the wrong way if you think he's trying to friend-zone you. It's just that for something to grow further it may need to be based on true friendship, have true friendship at its root. He may not wish to be boxed in with what might seem to him as arbitrary definitions of what it means to be in a relationship. If you both nurture it it can evolve to its full potential. But it seems his feelings are deep towards you and he doesn't take you lightly and his feelings for you are sweet and tender and multi-dimensional. Be grateful. Let him come to his own realization that this is an aspect of love. But don't cage him in. That could actually be a turn off. True love should be unconditional.
That being said, he may not be a kiss and tell kind of guy, we tend to be private in some ways and have no boundaries in other ways. Things like holding hands in public, and even using terms of endearment can seem difficult. What you don't know is that the sound of your name in his mind may feel sweeter than any term of endearment on the planet. If signals seem mixed for you it's because he doesn't conform to pre-established constructs of predictability and behaviour expected of someone who is typical, he's not.
In a way, think of him as though a foreigner, with an emotional language barrier, but still with a heart. A heart that obviously has you in it. There is no mixed signal about that. Bathe in that glory. It's stupendous. Wonderful.
Also, be very very careful about things like moves. Moving can be beyond stressful for him, down right traumatic. He may be the type to want some things just so and doing so would require that he upset many of the things that bring him calm and structure. This is not necessarily an OCD thing tho it may seem like it. It's how we sometimes make sense of things and attempt to establish living baselines. The subject and activity of moving should be done with kid gloves with as much support and facilitation as possible should he decide to do so but should not feel pressured to do so. Motivation works better than pressure here. Applying pressure here may be like applying pressure to a mule.
His getting directions to different places helps add to this order. Aspies come in all types. My brother has an immediate photographic memory when it comes to directions and surroundings. I can't find my way out of a paper bag. GPS has made my life so much easier. So much easier!
Anyways, those are my thoughts for now.
You seem to be on the right track.
You have definately and are a great compass. I guess my fear is that I am so in love and expecting rejection for some reason and am scared of rejection because I love him so much. Only 2 more days before I visit him. I thought it was sweet when he gave me the room number and said "our room is on the ground floor." I am hoping this will be a great weekend and that we can move the relationship to the next level. I will keep you posted. I hope all is well with you.
You don't sound clinical. All your insight and advise has been great. SO the weekend is almost done. We slept in separate beds- it was a nice weekend and we cuddled at night when we watched television. He lay his head on my lap and I had my arms around him and then another night I lay to his side in between his legs with my head on his belly. He was comfortable and it didn't seem awkward. When it came to after he wasn't comfortable in sharing the bed- with no other intentions. This was strange I thought. But we did have warm physical contact. Thanks so much for your help and you insight on this weekend would be good as well. He was able to do his routine stuff and didn't seem like me being here made him feel odd.
I will post my comment in 2 parts as I believe I will exceed the limit number of letters a comment can contain !!
I met my ex in Australia while I was backpacking over there and I am almost 100% sure he has asperger. We dated for four months and from the very beginning of the relationship, he told me he didn't want to have a long distance relationship once he will be moving to the US (as he got a job offer by google that he couldn't miss) and he was very scared to hurt my feelings as it happened to his ex girlfriend when he broke up with her after a few months dating. So we dated for 4 months and the last month he asked me to move with him to his house. The whole time I didn't dare telling him I wanted us to try the long distance relationship as I thought he was the one who should have said it if he wanted the relationship to go forward. He told me more than once how happy he was that I found him and that I made his year so much better. One day he would tell me he wants to come with me to Europe and visit my country before to leave for the US and another time I would mention the trip he would answer me "oh you know I am terrible at planning things, make your own plans and I will see if I join you or not at the end..." I got frustrated and made my own plan by deciding to join friends for a 2 weeks road trip in Vietnam on my way back to Spain, 3 weeks before he would leave Australia for the US. We spent the last two weeks together traveling around Australia in a van. Sometimes I had the feeling he wanted us to keep on with the relationship even after we got separated but he never said it clearly... For exemple he would tell me that I could do my work in Canada in Montreal which wasn't that far from New York (knowing that immigrate to the US is too complicated) or once he even told me "when we are going to be in New-York..Oh ! did you hear that ?! I said WE.." and holding me in his arms like he will miss me... Unfortunately I didn't know how to react and remained a bit emotionless (Stupid I know!) Anyway the last night we spent together was really emotional and he cried more than once but when I was saying that if we really want to see each other again it's possible, he answered me "well, will see how it goes..." One more time his answer was pretty disappointing for me..
So I took my plan and we were texting every day during my road trip. The thing is 3 days after I left he told me he went to Sydney for his american visa and went out in a bar where he met foreign girls and had fun, he even said something like see I am much more social when I am alone ! I was very surprised he went to a bar coming to the fact he hates all those party places and never wanted to join me at parties..Later he told me it was because he was feeling sad and lonely because of my departure... anyway that night he met an Italian girl whith who he planned another road trip in a van, exactly the same that we just had... I got very angry at him as for me he was ruining our special moments by creating that quick other similar memories with a random girl... His first reaction was to say he could cancel it if it makes me upset and that he could come to Spain instead which I encouraged him to do so. Unfortunately after checking if he could change his flishts, he told me it would be too expansive to do so... We skyped because he asked me but I asked him where we were going "not being in a relationship anymore but texting all the time and now skyping while he was planing a trip with a girl" he couldn't give me any answer and so I told him it would be better for me if we stopped texting as I needed to move on. He agreed. He did this roadtrip with this random girl... random girl that he finally dated (as I predicted) and ask her to join him in the US !!! I felt so bad when I have learned that because of Facebook... :( I sent him a last text telling him I couldn't understand how he could start a long distance relationship with a girl he barely knows whereas with me after 4 months and one living together he never wanted to... He answered me the worst thing a man ever answered me in my life but I believe this is because he doesn't realise how much words can hurt people.. He basically told me he didn't fall in love with me even though he grew up very fond of me but he would have not gone out with me if there wasn't an expiration date (I found this sentence particularly cruel to say...) and that girl was a better fit that anyone else he ever dated in the past. (This girl who is 4 years younger than him, 7 years younger than me and who just finished high school...) I never answered him back and blocked him on Facebook to not see again what is happening in his life. It's been 5 months now since I left Australia and I still can't understand his behaviour...
Lately a friend of us reported me that he posted a picture of an Australian beach on his wall using by google for whatever reason and he posted as a commentary to this post a picture of me he took at this beach during our road trip saying "the last picture I took there 8 months ago" This post disturbed me a bit as - First it was 5 months ago and not 8 - Second why did he post this picture whereas his new girlfriend is right now with him in New York (under a tourist visa) and he actually went to the exact same beach with her after we did and probably has pictures with her too, or even though he could have posted a picture of the landscape only, don't you think it is kind of weird...?!
Even if I know not all aspies are the same, I would be very interested in having your point of view about the relationship I had with him ? If you could help me understand just a little bit what happened in his head I would be very grateful :)
I am considered the NT girlfriend even though half the time I think I may have many aspie personalities. I recently took time too look for clinical explanations to my boyfriend's recent fits and or break downs this past summer when his now sober alcoholic father visited. We are 40 years old. I am a Registered Nurse. Who is in Love with a Wonderful now Aspie per symptoms and agreement.
I grew up in a Finnish culture which I believe allowed/allows me to have a special understanding or at least acceptance of those quirky differences my aspie lover has exasperated through out our 4 year relationship. We went 3.5 years without knowing about AS. We didn't fight much at all if any. I accepted him for his wishes and he did also with mine. We naturally flow. We get out of each other what we have always needed out of partners. Fights began this past summer. After his breakdown. (his colossal break up with me out of the blue even though we sweated love every day) He gave basic reasons that sounded as if he had been coerced by the evil NTs who like to take advantage of Aspies. It was unfathomable even with his reasons. He always said that "too much Has happened" . maybe when I came out with being an recovering alcoholic? And along with letting him know I suffer with depression,anxiety, and ptsd? Was is it my breakdown when I tried overdosing on medication? (unknowingly I was having a hard time) . So I questioned obviously what was wrong with me even though I treated him with the most respect. It turned out to be that he was processing incidents in a delusional way. Believing things were one way but realistically it was fine or at least typical. Today we know he falls into what I call are Aspie Fits or breakdowns. Since Aspies have a more black and white thinking pattern fits and breakdowns tend to be the same but just a tad different.
These fits are triggered. By Anxiety, confrontations, fear, and other uncomfortable feelings he experiences he is unable to cope with. This leads to instant delusional Thinking. Irrational . Meaningless attacks. He says he can't help himself from telling me to leave and that he is done with our relationship. Belittling me and becoming physically violent at the same time. His eyes big out and widen as if he was taken over by a evil spirit. He basically calls it quits because so much has happened and or has been said. Again he turns to this... I think it's his personal feeling of anxiety and this is how he expresses it. He is in an uncontrollable state and says I put him there. It's my consistent verbal explanations on why I need certain attention. Or I bring up a trend of non verbal communication on certain things in our relationship where he feels beat down. I would have to stop expressing my needs to make him not fall into these. But that's unrealistic. I believe educating him is one way to get through to him.
So as I regressed,
Aspies love is a very intoxicating innocent kind of love that I feel is pure and worth fighting for.
Its been a while since I last wrote. Things with my Aspie man are coming along well, a little slow but good. We have established that we are in a relationship. He took me to the bank last week and informed me of his savings as we met with his banker and I was totally surprised and not expecting this. They asked him if I was his wife and he replied "she could be". It was like we are a couple. We live in two different cities. He hasnt told me he loves me or misses me. I went up and stayed with him for 10 days in his apt which was the first time and we slept in the same bed and cuddled. I think sex will come, What is your input on all this?
So much has happened since I last posted, My Aspie man and I have come a long way even though we continue to live in different cities and have not seen each other as often as possible due to time off work.
Last week I stayed with him for 10dasy which is the first time we spent that much time together, he has his quirks. He took me to the bank as he had an appt with his advisor. As we walked in they greeted us and asked him if I was his wife and he replied "she could be". He in brought me in with him where i was involved with his decisions on banking and he was totally transparent on his savings and amount in his account. The banker treated us as a couple. We have in a round about way indicated that we are in a relationship. He introduced me to all the people he works with. We went walking and we held hands as well. We slept in the same bed and we cuddled. He is such a warm and gentle person. We havent had sex yet.
What do you think of all this?
Regarding sex, you may need to be very very explicit but not shocking. Baby steps at first, until you break his threshold. He must feel comfortable and it is possible he may feel inadequate as well so patient seduction and loving acceptance is probably key. It seems you're almost there. Feel free to get him to practice understanding how it is that you feel as well. Vigilantly learn from his unspoken queues as well. Hie heart and soul may be burning and aching for you and he may have difficulty expressing it. Don't be surprised if after some patient and subtle nudging you suddenly unleash the wanton animal in him lusting for abandon sex. Yet he, as a consequence of his nature, may be inexperienced, feel a bit intimidated and inadequate. He, holding you in high regard and esteem probably also doesn't want to 'do it wrong' and probably doesn't want to disappoint. This is where comfort, understanding, acceptance, and anything that will put him at ease will come into play. Best wishes seriously. :)
Happy New Year to you to and thanks again for your response. Yes- this is a huge learning curve for me. The more time i spent with him- the more I love him and the more time I want to spend with him. I guess- things are slower to develop becuase we live in 2 seperate towns. He hasnt talked about our future and what he wants and that makes me feel insecure. I know he cares and loves me. Usually, he tells me everything about him when we talk and he is pretty chatty. He will tell me about his day, his experiences, his challenges, what he ate. Although, sometimes I feel like he knows only the tip of the iceberg about me and my life. Im going through a seperation right now and he has never brought that up or asked me how i am coping with it. I am visiting him again in 3 months and I just returend 2 weeks ago from visiting him and he had asked me to leave my stuff there so I dont have to carry a big suitcase each time. He also asked me if I wanted to keep a set of his apartment keys and that i was welcome to do anything at his place that I wanted. Which was very sweet. I just wish i had a clearer insight into his desire for our future. He will ask me about what he should do with his investments and also when offered a credit card what limit would be reasonale to have- i dont know if this is a sign of love or if it is just that he is looking for advice. Your advice is always a God sent and your support invaluable to me. Thanks
haha It's still a huge learning curve for me and that's that I'm Aspie. But I've taken it on as a special interest. We are all different. I have encountered some of my peers that kind of live in the moment. I tend to plan things a bit more than some of my peers. So, even though there is a lot of camaraderie, this can be a source of frustration and can sometimes be like "pulling teeth". But, wanting to know when he will see you next in a way is a sort of future projection, so that is a bit promising. Yes, we can be quite chatty when unleashed, sometimes tiringly chatty. And we can be mighty quiet for extended periods of time as well. I'm glad you have the patience and interest. Such is love. :-)
If you want him to know more about you and your family, simply ask him if he wants to know or what he wants to know. We don't take well to implicit ambiguations. It can be quite the challenge. But whatever you do don't corner him. If it becomes too overwhelming he may seemingly inexplicably trigger to shut you off from process overload. Some situations must be eased into. Sometimes we shut-down, shut-off or melt-down if we feel that things get too intense for us to handle.
He's obviously reached a certain level of comfort and trust with you though.
His including you into financial aspects and decisions may just means he wanted advice but also may denote a degree of trust you have achieved. If this is a change from when you first met him that may be the case. If he's always been this way it could also mean that he has boundary issues. Lots of us do. Observe how he behaves around strangers. If he exhibits too much familiality with perfect strangers that might 'clue you in'. This boundary issue can at times be misleading and give off airs of there being more closeness than actually exists. It's important that you must be very perspicacious. We constantly give off misleading messages and symbols. Remember, speaking and acting in neurotypical is not our first language. It is not our innate culture. It's like we are foreigners in some far off land learning the customs and courtesies of that host country and its people.
I cant offer advice as I find myself always questioning and reading my AS man. I can completely understand your connection with him and also how special he is for you. All I can say is that you have to be patient and also gain his trust, its hard and I have been through this. Its painful when we do not interupt things correctly. With my man I think each time i tried to bring something up it updet him becuase he thought maybe it would be me ending it. Seems like a lot of fear maybe of rejection from both sides. COmmunicate and understand each other, its hard. Instead of surprising him by a visit- can you call him and talk and tell him how you feel?
Best of luck.
If it's him being Asperger-ish, I can cope, say to myself "well, I need to accept him as he is," and not get angry. If I'm misreading the situation, I'm being the blind fool, potentially making myself pitiful in his eyes. My family already thinks he's taking me for a ride.
I know the frustrations from the NT point and try so hard to be understanding of the AS man in my life. I keep reminding myself that he cant always relate and that he isnt being insensitive or purposely hurtful. Its hard- he seems to focus on himself a lot and not interested in other people. I have been sick and he hasnt appeared to be as concerned as my other NT friends. I always tell him I love him and he doesnt say anothing back and will just respond with ok or nothing. Sometimes, I feel like i make all the effort. Its true I wonder if he does love me or miss me. I wonder if i left his life- would it even matter, would he care. I do feel like im not of value and taken for granted. It may just be the AS, but it still hurts. He is very sweet. I do think Anonymous- you need to talk to him. It may give you what you need either way. I feel your pain, i really do.
Given that your boyfriend is undiagnosed, he's not going to listen to anything that you say about Asperger's.
Assuming that he's just not understanding what he needs to do, you simply need to tell him directly what it is that you want him to say and do. If you do this and he still doesn't do it, then it's not "ignorance" but a deliberate choice on his part.
A person with Asperger's is generally not going to know what to do "socially" but can usually do things once they've been told what to say and do. There are mean people with Aspergers, just as there are mean people with every kind of condition but Asperger's itself doesn't make a person mean.
I'm worried about a few of the things you said; "he is mean to me and puts me down alot.", "He constantly says i don't appreciate him," and "i pretty much slave to him". These aren't things you necessarily associate with Asperger's. They sound much more like Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
Is there a way to send you a private message? I started typing here, but in order to give you the entire story of my suspected Aspie it will be long.
I could really use your advice and take on my situation, as I've never met anyone like him before and feel confused and lost most of the time.
You can always send me messages via the link on the About page. I'm sometimes a little slow to respond because I get a lot of mail and I like to make sure that when I do respond, it's thoughtful... sometimes I need a few days to really think about the right responses.
As for Miguel, he's a regular on this thread and I'm sure he'll be in touch.
I think that I am involved with a guy who is undiagnosed. While we were friends for quite sometime, I always thought he was just very shy, socially awkward and quiet. Finally we crossed the line sexually many months ago, I was surprised by his interest in me since he never expressed interest. He confessed that he had had interest for years but was too scared to make a move, since he thinks I am way out of his league. Which is actually true.
We have been up and down for quite some time now. We talk daily, and flirt, but havent seen eachother for a few months even though we live within an hour of eachother. He will sometimes invite me somewhere but then not follow through which is exasperating.
I used to think that perhaps he was just an a***hole, and I told him so. He got incredibly upset about me thinking this. Recently I noticed that he meets all the criteria for Asbergers. his inability to respond appropriately to my cues or any social cues, his incredible social awkwardness, where he wont even speak to anyone in a group setting but rather just sort of hover watching our ineractions, his admitted anxiety about what he writes on my facebook wall in fear of being ridiculed, flat affect, his antiquated and somewhat bizarre use of phrases, routine dietary and daily habits, and him appearing to be devoid of any emotional response, or empathy. Yet he is very kind and never means to hurt anyone. This I know because we have been friends for a long time and I know he has a good heart.
After I came up with my own diagnosis I changed my communication with him and started leaving out the "I feel" statements or any emotion since I knew he wouldnt be able to relate, and just stated very clearly what i do or do not like and what I need him to do. This actually had much better results than previous attempts on my part to get him to relate to me.
I guess at this point I am looking for a way to figure out if 1. he wants to actually date me, since I cannot figure out if hes just not into me and also has Asperger - which could be the case, but all interactions point to him liking me, and 2. how to gauge his feelings, since he may not even know himself. I know that he is not seeing anyone else seriously. I presume he is still on dating sites though. He really wants to connect and be with someone. I just cannot figure out if it is me because he is intimidated by me a bit I think.
How to I go about this. I am not keen on the idea of rejection from him, but I feel that I need to bite the bullet here and just ask him and tell him I want to be with him? I dont want to scare him away though. Is it common for them to stay in limbo with you not making a move?
The best thing that you could do is ask the question directly (maybe via an email as this will give him time to think).
Make sure that you make your expectations for changes clear.
Don't go out with (kiss) any other girls during the time that you are "dating".
Take your profile off the dating sites while you are dating.
These things seem obvious to you but they might not be so obvious to him unless you explicitly state them.
While he regularly contacts me, he has professed his love (albeit when he was intoxicated), but refuses to see me. He seems to lack the executive functioning to make these decisions and does not see the impact they are having on us. Its been months with no contact except his regular weekly messages. flirting, making sexual innuendos, sending me provacative photos. Ive had to broach the subject of us very carefully in fear of scaring him or overwhelming him like I did in the past so we tiptoe around it these days.
Im always wondering if hes just the embodiment of ultimate emotional unavailability and maleness or if this is due to his AS. its difficult to figure out where one begins and the other ends.
I fear we may never see eachother again due to his inability to make plans with me, we live relatively close to one another yet it never seems to happen and when we try some roadblock always stands in the way like poor timing, someone already has plans, etc. Unfortunately I Am feeling too rejected emotionally and fragile to suggest plans with him these days. I am terrified of being rejected by him again, and so I just hope hell plan with me.
This is a man who I know cares for me deeply, but I simply am at a standstill on figuring out how to motivate him to make plans to see me. How can I encourage him to want to see me and make plans?
The truth can sting from time to time. Brutal bullshit and brutal lies can sting too. Not all brutality is honest and not all honesty is brutal!
Meanwhile, there's a *third* option. I don't have to sacrifice my well-being to date a so-called aspie who uses me in ways that hurt me in order to avoid dating an NT who you claim wants to hurt me. I can avoid dating that NT *and* avoid dating that so-called aspie at the same time, because I can stay single instead of dating either! :)
OTOH, it could also mean that he or she does want to be with you but expresses it differently.
It could even mean that he or she really likes dinosaurs a lot, and that "I don't want to be with you" is his or her totally unique and nonconformist and different way of expressing "I REALLY LIKE DINOSAURS!"
Once you decide that you shouldn't take into account what someone actually says and does in order to figure out what he or she probably means then you can ignore whatever he or she actually says and does, make up *anything*, and say he or she really means *that* instead.
I think that you need to start to get a handle on the small things.
So... I'd recommend that you create a list of perhaps ten non-permanent achievable things that you want to do;
1. Have dinner with his mother (all three of you)
2. Spend New Years Eve together
I'd also suggest that you ask him to write a similar list because this will give you a lot of insight into what he cares about, what he wants and what he needs.
Then, once per month, perhaps ... you do something off his list and he does something off yours. If that's too hard, then alternate, so he only has to do six things, one every second month.
Setting the rules will help with someone who has Asperger's.
I hope this helps.
For example, I needed to reassess how much time I was spending on university projects, how much time was going to sleeping in, playing games, reading books etc. I didn't have to give up everything but I did have to try and squeeze a few more hours out of the week.
So, for example, getting up earlier meant that I could spend time on assignments in the morning instead of later at night when it was prime "going out time".
The affect Aspies have on their partners can be very destructive.
My ex won't believe he is Aspie. He told me he loved me while we spent 36 hrs in bed together after a fantastic NYE together. Less than 6 days later he is already dating again.
Aspies are heartless. They love themselves and destroy people workout a care in the world. Other people don't matter.
Uh, no. I am an aspie. 6 months ago i broke up with my girlfriend (i dumped her) and some days i wish i was still with her. I miss being close and intimate and telling her how nice it was to hold her. I miss hearing her say nice things and cuddling up with me too.
What i don't miss is when she used to start drama on the drop of a pin. Especially when she got drunk. I wasnt going to spend the rest of my life being verbally chewed on like that.
Days have gone by and we are no longer texting or seeing each other even though we spent nearly every day together for months and months and were integral in each other's lives. I texted to say I knew he had been overworked for months, not felt well this summer due to having to work in the heat due to his job a lot, and that I hoped he is feeling better. I said that I wanted to get his thoughts on when he can come back to my house to finish working on the stuff left undone that only he can do and that I needed to give my parents an update on the work (since they own the house and it's their money we've spent to pay him). He only replied that he was "on call" this weekend for his job. I had tried to verbally bring up this question of when the work will be finished about a week ago and he snapped at me that he is sick of me asking him about it and if I asked again he might not do it at all. Of course this felt like a slap in the face, came out of nowhere, and I was horrified inside yet again thinking "how did I get so tied to someone who thinks it's okay to speak to me like this?!"
Now I do not know how to proceed. He has left all those expensive big tools here at my house. Do I just wait around weeks and weeks more until he finally texts to say he can come finish the work? The house is livable but I work full time, have four children, and am about to start grad school classes two nights a week. I need to get the work done. It seems that we are officially "broken up" or at least no longer friends.
Should I accept he is abandoning the work? Should I attempt to smooth over our friendship so we can finish? Cut my losses and hire someone else to finish even though we already paid him for the work? If I hire someone else he will probably never speak to me again and may insist on returning the money we paid him for the work he did do and not even come claim his tools. I am in therapy and have read several books on NT/AS relationships and do have the support of a friend and my parents who have seen what my interaction with him has done to me emotionally and support a slow fade at least but still, even they and the therapist are not sure what to do about finishing the remodel.
First, it doesn't matter why he's speaking you you like that, he's still speaking to you like that. - no matter how much other people will say it's part of Asperger's/his culture/masculinity/whatever.
Now the question is, do you want to stay so tied to someone who thinks it's okay to speak to you like that, or not? If not, then can you safely untie yourself?
"Should I accept he is abandoning the work? Should I attempt to smooth over our friendship so we can finish? Cut my losses and hire someone else to finish even though we already paid him for the work? If I hire someone else he will probably never speak to me again and may insist on returning the money we paid him for the work he did do and not even come claim his tools. I am in therapy and have read several books on NT/AS relationships and do have the support of a friend and my parents who have seen what my interaction with him has done to me emotionally and support a slow fade at least but still, even they and the therapist are not sure what to do about finishing the remodel."
As for finishing the remodel and finally having a home you and your kids can thrive in, if you wait for your ex then you don't owe more money but it'll still probably cost you the stress of waiting an unpredictable time. If you hire someone else then it will cost you more money but it'll probably not also cost you the stress of waiting an unpredictable time.
"If I hire someone else he will probably never speak to me again and may insist on returning the money we paid him for the work he did do and not even come claim his tools."
This could be a second-best-case scenario (first-best being he stops treating you so badly and finishes the work himself immediately):
* By not speaking to you again, at least he won't be speaking to you hurtfully and you can get on with your life including dating other men if you like
* His returning the money would make up for the money you spend hiring someone else
* His leaving the tools behind could be an extra bonus, making it easier for the next person you hire to continue the work with the same tools that were used on your house before (and then you get to keep the tools for yourself, in case you want to use or sell them later).
Like, I didn't quite understand what was going on, and she literally always pretended that if I didn't do and say exactly and buy her exactly what she wanted that it was by choice, and not the result of limited time, organizational skills, or money. My stomach is twisting in knots just remembering it.
"Too many tears I've cried, so much pain inside...." (Lenny Kravitz)
As some philospher I once heard about said "99% of pain in the world is caused by misunderstanding....".
I am now a 68 year old Aspie. Discovering this came about thus: was looking up info on David Byrne (Talking Heads) and he said he was a self-diagnosed AS person. I knew nothing about it and went and looked it up....
"I found your diary underneath a tree, and started reading about me..." (David Gates - Bread)
I couldn't believe it - my personage laid bare. I took an online test to see; 44/50.
Suddenly all the pieces of my life's puzzle that had been flying around dropped to the ground to form a completed picture. For the first time I began to understand why I had felt different from other kids in my classes, why I saw the world differently to them and couldn't understand them, why I was singled out, teased, mocked and bullied for years...
Why I never had a lovelife at a time when it could have been all mine had I not been so timid, unable to read the
cues that were floating in front of my eyes, scared of being able to make a move, frightened of being rejected. It grew worse with time. I was unable to mingle easily at parties and tended to hang around if I did at all with people I knew
"You'll always find me in the kitchen at parties" (Jona Lewie)
I could not understand the implicit body language that others obviously understood (with the benefit of hindsight) and that has never changed. Just because I can now identify my flaws and failings doesn't change my lack of perceptive abilities on the social front.
Signs were there when I was a child but nobody understood them. Like the time a little girl who lived next door (we were both about 3 years old) wanted to play with me in my sandpit and received a bucketful of sand for her trouble (my mother related that one to me - I can't remember it at all).
As a teenager my inability to read signs, having a crush on a female peer that was so intense it was like an internal explosion and my not knowing what to do, backing off thinking at was all taboo, freezing up inside, not wishing to offend her etc. Story of my life. I happened several times during my life (with women about my age) and my being too scared to do anything, not having any way of knowing whether feelings were mutual etc. Also aping what others were doing and in the process giving signals without knowing what I was doing or communicating......
As my life progressed, I found it easier to suppress my inner feelings, stay away from "awkward" situations lest I cause offense or harm, all the while hating myself and living in agony. Unrequited love - nothing is so painful and I have experienced a lot of physical pain.
One crush in my mid-20s in particular could have been but ended unrequited when there was an unexpected interruption to what might have been a beginning in my flat and resulted in my total withdrawal a few weeks later when I saw her again in a pub and she told me "you have a rival". I was shattered and that was that. No stomach for a competition. Easier to disappear. Story of my life basically.
I had a terrible time mixed-flatting with others when I was much younger and experienced the understanding disconnect time and time again. I just could not get on with others and from my perspective looking back, they understandably didn't understand me at all.
I did have several brief sexual relationships along the way but no passion or what I think of as love there. I was once seduced by a neighbour and had a few months of great sex but she dropped the ball when she hinted that I should be asking her to move into my place (she was renting next door). I reminded her that on our first night she'd said "no strings" at which point I think the end of it was beginning - she dumped me on some pretentious excuse a few months later. Took me a couple of years to get over it emotionally.
I hope there might be an insight or two in my story that others who are trying to understand how I as a definite Aspie (and from what I've been reading in this blog, many others) tick. It has been a life of pain which will end when I die (I have incurable prostate cancer - how ironic is that!!)
Lastly, I have special talents (music, electronics design etc.), once was admitted to MENSA (bunch of users and IMO losers) and have enjoyed many outdoor activities, some categorized as risk-taking. Also, I think in pictures and have done technical things my entire working life. I have always been comfortable in my own company, perhaps of necessity for want of a real social life, doing things by myself and still enjoy going for a solo tramp from time to time.
What I am trying to convey in this rambling note is Aspies can feel very deeply, can go into damage-avoidance mode quickly and do need our own space, at least in my case. I find interacting with other people to be tiring, small talk to be difficult and boring (no point). "That's the way it is.." (Bruce Hornsby) - out of context but fitting.
So finally (phew!), in my teens I thought "love" was this overwhelming desire to be "with" a certain someone (crush) and never connected it with sex, thought "romance" was the same and always thought of sex as being something separate altogether (maybe it's the way I was told about it by my father who simply presented me with a small book to read which explained the mechanics and not much else).
Hope some of this helps others to understand me and perhaps other Aspies. Instant chemistry for me was always an overwhelming, almost frightening experience. I think what is taken to be a lack of interest in a special someone was, in my case, a deep desire to be with that someone but frightened to spoil it (and hence running from it). I usually ended up thinking that I was not good enough and undeserving.
I decided to write this as there are few things I missed in my first two posts which may be more helpful or explanatory to NTs wishing to understand me and others like me.
I have never attended school reunions, nor ex-work ones. I just do not want to ever see those people again. Partly I think because I still feel like a 10 year-old inside and would rather remember what happier times I had as they were and partly because I cannot bear to see the people who were mean to me again.
I have occasionally bumped into one or two of those past aquaintances but all they wanted to do was pry and probe and ask me about what I am doing now, catch up on what I've done. I had no desire at all to want to tell them anything about me. I think I was hurt so badly. Perhaps, there is a partial answer to the otherwise inexplicable flight - leave the past in the past because I do not want any chance of reliving it. Speaking of which I hope my conciousness dies with me - I never want to live again in this world. Too much cruelty. What is happening in Ukraine is affecting me badly.
There is one major exception - a lifelong male friend (strictly Platonic) who had some common interests (we enjoyed doing up his motorbikes - I made up wiring looms for them) and we played together in a band. He is truly a friend for life and does seem to understand me. He has lived in Australia for decades now but it is like time does not exist when he occasionally rings me up and we talk and talk for hours. Of all people I've known he probably had more to do with my not going off he deep end than anyone. Quirky as I was he seemed to understand me. I value our friendship enormously. I also enjoyed enormously the kindness his parents treated me with. They were the nicest people (despite some ridiculous rumours about them and their dogs). Visits were frequent - it was in effect my second home.
I wisk I had known all this when I was much younger. I think my life might have been so much different and many heartaches avoided had I understood why I didn't understand others and been able to do something about it.
Meanwhile, I just heard a song on the radio which I've heard before but this time in the midst of my inner turmoil I actually "heard" the lyics for the first time. I reckon it's a song about an NT/Aspie relationship gone sour. It's called "Just Somebody That I Used To Know" and it's performed by Kimbra.